"Inglourious Basterds" and the problem of Jew identification
I went to see the recently-released movie "Inglourious Basterds" -- a holocaust-themed movie -- because I wanted to see how it handled the problem of Nazi identification of Jews and non-Jews in the holocaust. I have long contended that a "systematic" Jewish holocaust was impossible because the Nazis had no objective and reliable ways of identifying Jews and non-Jews. Of course, the movie glosses over this problem of Jew identification -- the Jewish characters in the movie don't even look Jewish. Also, the movie begins with Nazis hunting Jewish farmers in the French countryside; if you are going to exterminate six-million Jews, you can't afford to spend much time hunting individual Jews.
The movie begins with a lot of pointless atrocities which to me did not really contribute to the movie, but the movie later has a lot of good suspense.
It was very sad about Shosanna and Frederick (pictured) -- in different circumstances, they could have had a very good relationship.
According to this article, the proliferation of holocaust-themed movies has reached the saturation point.
If you have not seen the movie, I recommend that you don't read the Wikipedia article about it, as that article will spoil the plot.
Labels: Holocaust revisionism (new #1)
posted by Larry Fafarman | 8/26/2009 09:17:00 PM
22 Comments:
Problem being, you're still an idiot.
Remember when people read the posts you made instead of skimming to see if comments had made it through your "larry-filter"?
Oh, those were the days, of honest discourse and interesting conversation. How i miss those days.
I guess someone should've told my grandma's mom that her family wasn't *actually* being shot one by one right in front of her. Nazi's didn't have that sort of time to waste! -- she could've saved herself the trouble of fleeing to an unknown continent as a young girl.
And those are some good actors they hired to make all those fake 1930's films of starving men women and children in concentration camps. How'd they make those pressure chamber experiments look so real though?
Boy they must've had some mad good special effects those jews. They're thrifty.
>>>>>>> Boy they must've had some mad good special effects those jews. <<<<<<<
Bozo, you still have not described any objective and reliable ways that the Nazis had for identifying Jews and non-Jews.
The Catholic Church was instrumental in helping the Nazi regime to identify Jews with its birth and family records. Pope Pious the 12th was a certified Nazi collaborator and made the Hitler's birthday (April 20th)a holiday.
Bozo?
it was a gradual build up. They didn't just one day say "all jews come here and we'll put you in concentration camps."
First they started with little things like simply asking all Jews to wear a star on their clothing. Then they were segregated into ghettos, and they'd have no choice but move there, seeing as nobody would hire jews by that point.
How did they know if you were jewish in the first place? The same way dictatorial regimes find dissenters to this very day (in my home country of Argentina, for example, in the 70's many people were murdered and tortured by the government for their beliefs... wait, maybe that didn't happen either: after all, what's an objective reliable way to identify people' beliefs? boy, what bozos).
All it takes is one of your neighbors suspecting you're a jew. He calls the police on you. The police shows up at your house and asks you for documentation and search your home.
The end.
Did you seriously think that people would've had to "look jewish" in order for the Holocaust to be possible?
Christ.
THE HOLOCAUST IS DOCUMENTED ON FILM. THERE ARE COUNTLESS HOURS OF FILM DOCUMENTING CONCENTRATION CAMPS AND MEDICAL EXPERIMENTS CONDUCTED ON MEN WOMEN AND CHILDREN.
what more proof do you need than videos of things like a malnourished man being put in a pressure chamber until he dies?
>>>>>>> The Catholic Church was instrumental in helping the Nazi regime to identify Jews with its birth and family records. <<<<<<<
Did the Catholic Church keep records of non-Catholics? Duh.
I am sorry. Eichmann is a gentile name. Any german, gentile or jewish, could tell you that. There might be discussions on Eichman (with one single 'n' at the end), but Eichmann is clearly gentile. It *might* sound Jewish -- like Hertzfeldt sounds --, but once written down, it would be clear. By the way, Hertzfeldt is also not Jewish.
There are nuances here, on last name formation, that you seem not to know.
>>>>>> Eichmann is a gentile name. <<<<<<
You are so full of living crap that it is coming out your ears, bozo. Also, there are lots of other Nazi names that look Jewish.
Hey Larry, you're getting your ass kicked over at Respectful Insolence.
Creationism X Holocaust denial = stupidity[squared]
"The reason I bring this up is that the other day I saw the absolute dumbest example of Holocaust denial I've ever seen. Believe me, I've been in some of the deepest, darkest depths of Holocaust denial discussion boards, right in the heart of some of the nastiest, vilest, most despicable white power rangers, and I can't recall anything this ignorant of history and brain dead at the same time. It's also a perfect example of crank magnetism, in that he's someone who's very well known around ScienceBlogs for his creationist proclivities and is known to show up to troll the comments of several blogs when the topic of evolution comes up. His sheer crankitude surpasses that of even many anti-vaccine zealots that I encounter. (Hmmm. I wonder if he's into anti-vaccine quackery and "alternative medicine," too.)
Yes, I'm referring to Larry Fafarman, who apparently can't distinguish fantasy from reality, as he demonstrates in a post entitled Inglourious Basterds and the problem of Jew identification."
You're too cowardly to post all responses here. Can you take the heat of a hostile environment?
Also, supposedly many victims of the Jewish holocaust did not even think of themselves as Jews.
A "systematic" Jewish holocaust is so improbable that those who claim it happened have an especially heavy burden of proof.
Some moron somehow found enough brain cells to write this:
">>>>>> 2) Documents taken from synagogues listing members. <<<<<<<
The Nazis burned down all the synagogues."
If you remove the documents before you burn the synagogues, the documents don't magically disappear. Sheesh. What a nutcase.
"You stupid dunghill, supposedly the Nazis hatched their "final solution" plan at Wannsee in 1942, and by that time probably all the synagogues had been destroyed."
You fucking moron, the Nazis decided to identify the Jews in 1933. That's long before any of the synagogues were burned. The Nazis had over 5 years to collect the data before the first synagogue burned.
"Also, maybe the Jews destroyed the records to keep them out of the hands of the Nazis."
They didn't. We know this because the Nazis kept the records. And there were books published before the synagogues were burned that include the data and cite the synagogue records as the source. These books are used by geneaologists to this day.
You might want to actually learn facts about the Holocaust, since you obviously know jack shit about it.
>>>>>>>> If you remove the documents before you burn the synagogues, the documents don't magically disappear. <<<<<<<
Or the documents can be destroyed before the Nazis could get their hands on them, bozo.
The identification of Jews and non-Jews is central to the holocaust but has been almost completely ignored. Edwin Black, author of "IBM and the Holocaust," said, "few have asked."
Larry,
Have you been to the Holocaust Museum in Washington, D.C.? Perhaps you would find that interesting. You have to remember that back then, it was much easier to recognize Jews because they tended to be segregated.
True, a non-observant Jew whose family hadn't practiced in many years might not be identified as such. But any Jew whose family had practiced within the past few generations could be recognized by historical membership rolls at Temples, Jewish schools, and other Jewish institutions. Of course, some Jews weren't identified and managed to pass as gentiles but obviously many Jews were marked, forced to live in the ghetto and ultimately killed.
Yes, I'm descendant of Holocaust survivors so I guess you would probably call me biased.
Funny how you say that the Shoshanna character doesn't even *look* Jewish. The actress that played her, Melanie Lauren *is* Jewish. According to Wikipedia anyway.
Andrew Winters
I don't know that this will make a difference however, you can find the original concentration camp records on this site and you can peruse them if you wish. They are free for viewing until the end of the year. In Germany Austria and Switzerland you are required to register and have papers. They have always required registration. On the registration you put your religion. Before Hitler the Jews were some of the elite in Germany. No one was afraid to put down that they were Jewish. When Hitler took over he had these records. Finding out who the Jews were was not a worry unless they had no registration. Pretty much everyone did. You still have to have papers when you travel over the border on the trains.
As far as the neighbors are concerned, as long as they were registered Germans their word was gold. You could be accused of being a Jew and a lot of times there were no questions asked. They simply took you.
You can continue to play your game of believing that there was no Holocaust, but you have nothing to back up your beliefs. There are endless rooms of records to the contrary.
The History Man
Holocaust Page
To the History Man:
What makes you think that I have not already seen all of these stories several times over?
See my two post-label groups on holocaust revisionism.
You should at least consider doing a little research on a subject before expressing an opinion. You remind me of Creationists who attempt to dispute the facts of evolutionary theory without knowing anything about. They end up embarrassing themselves, as you have hear. The Nazis began the process of identifying Jews in the days when there was no reason for them to hide their religion. Plus birth records, census records, etc. You should know this. This is basic stuff. It's a starting point. You shouldn't have to be told this. It would be like someone claiming to be a mathematician but being ignorant of basic arithmetic.
You are very stupid, or at least very lazy. Your pathetic arguments cannot be defended and are, obviously, destroyed with absurd ease.
You need to change something on your blog. You say that you will not moderate comments in any way, but obviously this is not true.
Jim King barfed,
>>>>>> You should at least consider doing a little research on a subject before expressing an opinion. <<<<<
You should at least read what people have already written before accusing them of not doing any research. I have already addressed the issues you have raised -- see my "holocaust revisionism" post-label groups.
>>>>>> You need to change something on your blog. <<<<<<
No, the lousy trolls who have been sabotaging this blog need to change.
"The Nazis often rounded up people en masse -- there was no time for individual identification or individual genealogical studies."
Then who do you think they were rounding up en masse? People at random? Their own citizens? WHO? THAT is a "Reign of Terror", not meticulously finding out who is Jewish and who isn't.
>>>>>> Then who do you think they were rounding up en masse? People at random? Their own citizens? WHO? THAT is a "Reign of Terror", not meticulously finding out who is Jewish and who isn't. <<<<<<
Exactly - that is my point.
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